suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
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04-06-2016, 04:39 PM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
(03-06-2016 10:03 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Well, as you know, I suspect a lot of the harsher (or, as I prefer to say, the more Pauline) teachings of Jesus were later added to the base legend. The closest thing we have to evidence of corroborated Jesus-tales are the collections of sayings [Edit to Add: such as the Sermon on the Mount], as found in James and the alleged "Q-document", where the Gospels actually somewhat agree with one another, so perhaps it's not such a bad thing (if you're already inventing a fictional character for a movie, loosely based on the life of a real man) that they stuck with the "lovey-dovey" stuff.

Personally, I find the idea of a movie told from the Centurion's POV to be interesting; I might watch it. I very much enjoyed the two-part miniseries that the Lifetime channel did, based on the novel by Anita Diamant, on the women of the House of Jacob (Israel), showing the early and secret worship of Asherah, among other things. Despite the various liberties, I thought it was well-done and would watch it again. I think it's available on Netflix, if you haven't seen it.

It's quite possible (and refreshing to hear someone reference the alleged Q Document, never get that on Christian boards). Paul's influence is so widespread in Christianity, having written so much of the New Testament and having spread his brand of evangelism far and wide. I enjoy that Peter takes a potshot at him once in one of the books he wrote, essentially saying he rambles.

The Centurion starts hanging out with Hippie Jesus in the second half of the movie, so there is that to know as well. And if I had Netflix, I'd look it up, as is, I'll look for that novel, it sounds interesting! Thanks for the recommendation!

Need to think of a witty signature.
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08-06-2016, 01:48 AM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
thanks for responses all, l so want to open his eyes. l am sure many or most christians don't even know. l certainly didn't when l was one.
so l compiled a response and reckon l will send it via whats app and email, please advise on content. it is not the best written.

"its because my eyes are open and mind open, I no longer believe.
Before reaching 5, 9 million innocent children (many times more since most births go unregistered in poor countries), die per year, ~24,000 a day, 1,000 an hour, ~17 per minute. They're not just numbers, but somebody's child. Die from "natural" causes, UNICEF.
Thats a 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami tragedy, (killed over 230K ppl in 14 countries), every 9-10 days, but killing only innocent children under 5, many of their parents and family religious, praying to gods incl all interpretations of yaweh, christian god, for lessening of pain, agony, suffering and mercy on their child, prayers not answered.
Diarrheal diseases (such as cholera) kill more children than AIDS, malaria, and measles combined, making it the second leading cause of death among children under five 
Every 10mins someone dies of malaria, ~ 6 babies or children < 5 dies of starvation a minute, babies born with abnormalities, deformities, extreme indescribable gross deformities. Animals in world savage each other and even their young, and you believe in an all powerful, all 'loving' god. If you just open eyes and read his 'divinely inspired' book, you will see, misogyny, (1 Corinthians 14:33-35 NAB, sexism 1 Corinthians 11:3-10, Leviticus 15: 19-20
Sirach 9:2, Colossians 3:18, 1 Peter 3:1-2, No Mixed Marriages Ezra 9:1-2) a truly barbaric book, written by relatively 'sophisticated' bronze age men, espousing slavery (1 Peter 2:18), killing of own children who are disobedient, MATTHEW 15:4, Mark.7:9-13. Oohh! How loving, uh! killing others who believe in different gods, killing family members for the mere encouragement of worshipping other gods, Deuteronomy 13:6-10, encouraging rape and confinement, “Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man intimately. But all the girls who have not known man intimately, spare for yourselves. Numbers 31:17-18” Deuteronomy 22:28-29” “If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days." Child abuse is CERTAINLY allowed by the bible: The God of the Bible also allows slavery, including selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16& Psalms 137:9).
killing, plaguing, deliberately deforming, all innocents (incl those innocent babies) along with animals that would make the total psychopathic serial killers, dictators that have ever lived in human history seem like a none event. A book that 'has been divinely' inspired to cause divisions, kill own family Matthew 10:35-36, Mark 13:12, Luke 12:49-59, Isaiah 19:2and people of other religions Deuteronomy 13:12-18, Deuteronomy 17, that has talking donkeys, snakes, bushes, an over 600 year old man building an ark that gathered 7 pairs of male and female of every 'clean species' or 1 pair, Gen. 7:2, carnivores, herbivores. Just for starters Nile crocodiles, a 'mere' ~18ft long located in Sub-Saharan Africa would be “obedient” and not snap their jaws at all the delicious looking prey! Would of been one hell of a party on that ark built by this 600 year old man! As I said, you are an atheist to every other religion, dismissing even fellow christians as pagan followers because they belong to another church. Now, you just have one more religion to dismiss and you will no longer require that emotional crutch.
“Fairly clear, isn't it? A book, claimed by many to be "holy" in some way, instructs people to murder persons who do not believe in their god. Why haven't we heard more about this? Because many Christians are content to ignore certain parts of their bible while obsessing about others (i.e., cherry picking). And what of those who do not ignore such parts of their "sacred" text? We call them extremists...or worse.”
ricky, now I hope you understand why I don't or would never believe. I respect your right to continue but please don't encourage my children to pray before our meals with mum."
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08-06-2016, 07:00 AM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
Perhaps you can both read the bible together aloud beginning at page one. As you go you can make comments and ask questions regarding this or that?

Chances are he has never read it. Unless he is insane, it should bring about some questions. If he mentions "free will" you can say "Make sure to tell me when we come across the passage in case I missed it."
It is not there.

Sooner or later he must notice the evil being done at his god's command. Point out, when you come to it, that attacking Job is not the devil's idea. He acts at god's command.

By doing it together, he has no excuse not to read the book and may actually see it as an opportunity to evangelize you.

One never knows. Wink

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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08-06-2016, 08:06 AM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
Does he have children? If he does, ask him if god asked him to kill one of his children would he do it? In the unlikely event that he says yes, ask him which one and how would he do it? I think making xtians really come to terms with the visuals of this can be really eye opening about how utterly fucked up this passage is and how it is so promoted as a virtuous example of following god's commands no matter what.
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08-06-2016, 11:39 AM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
Ask him lots of questions. But ask them legitimately. Try not to be condescending. If you immediately cut him off, or laugh at what he's say (no matter how ridiculous or silly it is) He's going to close off. You want to make the conversation as civil as possible. This is your brother after all. You don't want to be militant. No one likes being talked to like their a child. (And i'm guilty of that) If you walk around like you know everything, like you have everything figured out. Nothing closes a conversation down quicker. You want him to come back with question for you. You just need to be ready.

"What is the best evidence you have for your belief?" "How did you rule out the other current religions, such as Buddhism, Islam, Scientology etc etc. to decide this was the "right" one?" "What is a god?"

The idea is to let him come up with the definitions and ideas. As the old saying goes give him enough rope to hang himself.

So let's say he say's to the question "What is a God?" he responds "He's a omnipotent omniscient and omnipresent being that created the universe."
Your follow up can be something like. "How do you know that?" "How dose that definition rule out any other gods?" and just go on from there.

Or if he say's I use faith to determine he is real you can ask "On a scale from 1-100, how much dose faith play a role in determining a god is real?" (most likely he'll say 100) You can then ask "That doesn't give much room for anything else. What would you say to the Hindu's that had 100% faith that his religion and depiction of his gods was true? Can a person put faith into something that wasn't true?" He might say "Well yeah, but i'm sure i'm right." you could respond with something like "OK so maybe faith isn't the best method for determining there is a god. If faith wasn't a factor what would be just as good evidence?"

Give him time to think about his answers. Don't jump to conclusion. It's hard because more time's then not you hear the somethings said over and over again and you have a grab bag of come backs at the ready. But the goal is to make him think about his conclusions. Most of the time people get into these things because they want to be a part of a community that at least projects they are close nit and there for each other.


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Don't Live each day like it's your last. Live each day like you have 541 days after that one where every choice you make will have lasting implications to you and the world around you. ~ Tim Minchin
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08-06-2016, 03:44 PM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
thanks for responses again, do you think my writing is a bit lengthy? theres just too much barbarity and savagery in that book written by bronze aged men

l am considering just changing the lst paragraph to:

"ricky, now I hope you understand why I don't or would never believe. just so you know, Christianity is an almagamation of ancient superstitious mythologies, with too many similarities to be a coincidence, Krishna, Dionysus, Horus, Buddha, Mithra, Osiris,, including virgin birth, walking on water, water to wine, healing blind, sick and performing miracles, killed or crucified (Horus) and resurrected. stories in bible also have remarkable similarities to much older myths, eg Gilgamesh and noahs ark. l respect your right to continue but please don't encourage my children to pray before our meals with mum.""

please comment on my overall fairly long msg! thanks again guys!
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08-06-2016, 03:54 PM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
(08-06-2016 07:00 AM)Banjo Wrote:  Perhaps you can both read the bible together aloud beginning at page one. As you go you can make comments and ask questions regarding this or that?

Chances are he has never read it. Unless he is insane, it should bring about some questions. If he mentions "free will" you can say "Make sure to tell me when we come across the passage in case I missed it."
It is not there.

Sooner or later he must notice the evil being done at his god's command. Point out, when you come to it, that attacking Job is not the devil's idea. He acts at god's command.

By doing it together, he has no excuse not to read the book and may actually see it as an opportunity to evangelize you.

One never knows. Wink

thanks, but we don't have that relationship! to sit down and read together! firstly time for him and me is tight! I know he will for certain at least check one passage that l gave. what did you mean "By doing it together, he has no excuse not to read the book and may actually see it as an opportunity to evangelize you." ? because when he does read some of those passages, he won/t want to evangelize me, and he already knows that my eyes are open and that have the cherry picking rose tinted jesuz(!) specs. though he did give me a thick book about the bible about year ago, it was a famous brain washed book. please comment on my proposed writing to him
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08-06-2016, 04:00 PM (This post was last modified: 09-06-2016 05:06 AM by Ruby.)
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
(08-06-2016 08:06 AM)Iñigo Wrote:  Does he have children? If he does, ask him if god asked him to kill one of his children would he do it? In the unlikely event that he says yes, ask him which one and how would he do it? I think making xtians really come to terms with the visuals of this can be really eye opening about how utterly fucked up this passage is and how it is so promoted as a virtuous example of following god's commands no matter what.

yes, he has 4 from 2 marriages. had 3 marriages altogether! his current wife is from a wealthy family, who he has 2 children. he easily gets emotionally hijacked. his first 2 kids to 1st wife are now 21 and 19 now. both despise him. little wonder. they were treated as verbal abuse bags! his even shouted in rage at his current kid, who is 4, for not eating, 'DO YOU WANT TO FEEL MY WRATH!'
please comment on my proposed writing to him
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10-06-2016, 01:52 AM
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
ok, sent msg today. he responded. how do u think l should reply?

"[13:04, 3/6/2016] Ricky: you sound like you never had yours open
[02:14, 10/6/2016] Nixon: honest truth, its because my eyes are open and mind open, I no longer believe.
[02:31, 10/6/2016] Nixon: ignoring the outright plagiarisms, contradictions (impossible!), anyone with a heart who actually reads the many many atrocities encouraged and committed, just like other ‘holy’ books, like the quran, will know this bronze aged written text, thats been translated countless times, fought over the texts to use for the versions of the bible, will know this is superstitious claptrap written to control people.
[02:33, 10/6/2016] Ricky: Quran is of sat@n......
[02:36, 10/6/2016] Ricky: not selling u anything Nixon, God gave you free will to believe or not.....if you wholeheartedly chose atheism over Truth, then God will further harden your heart & keep you blinded.
[02:36, 10/6/2016] Nixon: how loving!
[02:37, 10/6/2016] Ricky: yur perception is the wisdom of men
[02:39, 10/6/2016] Nixon: If you just open eyes and read his 'divinely inspired' book, you will see, misogyny, (1 Corinthians 14:33-35 NAB, sexism 1 Corinthians 11:3-10, Leviticus 15: 19-20
Sirach 9:2, Colossians 3:18, 1 Peter 3:1-2, No Mixed Marriages Ezra 9:1-2) a truly barbaric book, written by relatively 'sophisticated' bronze age men, espousing slavery (1 Peter 2:18), killing of own children who are disobedient, MATTHEW 15:4, Mark.7:9-13. Oohh! How loving, uh! killing others who believe in different gods, killing family members for the mere encouragement of worshipping other gods, Deuteronomy 13:6-10, encouraging rape and confinement, “Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man intimately. But all the girls who have not known man intimately, spare for yourselves. Numbers 31:17-18” Deuteronomy 22:28-29” “If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days." Child abuse is CERTAINLY allowed by the bible: The God of the Bible also allows slavery, including selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16& Psalms 137:9).
killing, plaguing, deliberately deforming, all innocents (incl those innocent babies) along with animals that would make the total psychopathic serial killers, dictators that have ever lived in human history seem like a none event. A book that 'has been divinely' inspired to cause divisions, kill own family Matthew 10:35-36, Mark 13:12, Luke 12:49-59, Isaiah 19:2and people of other religions Deuteronomy 13:12-18, Deuteronomy 17, that has talking donkeys, snakes, bushes, an over 600 year old man building an ark that gathered 7 pairs of male and female of every 'clean species' or 1 pair, Gen. 7:2, carnivores, herbivores. Just for starters Nile crocodiles, a 'mere' ~18ft long located in Sub-Saharan Africa would be “obedient” and not snap their jaws at all the delicious looking prey! Would of been one hell of a party on that ark built by this 600 year old man! As I said, you are an atheist to every other religion, dismissing even fellow christians as pagan followers because they belong to another church. Now, you just have one more religion to dismiss and you will no longer require that emotional crutch.
“Fairly clear, isn't it? A book, claimed by many to be "holy" in some way, instructs people to murder persons who do not believe in their god. Why haven't we heard more about this? Because many Christians are content to ignore certain parts of their bible while obsessing about others (i.e., cherry picking). And what of those who do not ignore such parts of their "sacred" text? We call them extremists...or worse.”
ricky, now I hope you understand why I don't or would never believe. just so you know, Christianity is an almagamation of ancient superstitious mythologies, with too many similarities to be a coincidence, Krishna, Dionysus, Horus, Buddha, Mithra, Osiris,, including virgin birth, walking on water, water to wine, healing blind, sick and performing miracles, killed or crucified (Horus) and resurrected. stories in bible also have remarkable similarities to much older myths, eg Gilgamesh and noahs ark. l respect your right to continue but please don't encourage my children to pray before our meals with mum.
[02:39, 10/6/2016] Ricky: anyways you are my brother, I must at the very least try to rekindle and tell you Truth....but as you say, your choice is solid and sounds final. to shake my feet from the dust of your door would be a sad thing.
[02:46, 10/6/2016] Nixon: read just some passages of the quoted, if u read then u know its right there wi the quran, sickening , absolutely absurd without rose tinted jesuz haleayah specs! l too was fooled, but now see. l know u will as well.
[02:50, 10/6/2016] Nixon: btw, Krishna, Dionysus, Horus, Buddha, Mithra, Osiris predate christianity by 100s-1000s of years
[02:50, 10/6/2016] Ricky: dude....the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to those of us who are being saved it is the power of God.
[02:51, 10/6/2016] Ricky: they are ALL fake, of sat@n
[02:51, 10/6/2016] Ricky: atheism is of sat@n also"
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10-06-2016, 07:39 PM (This post was last modified: 10-06-2016 07:42 PM by WhiskeyDebates.)
RE: suggestions how to respond to a newly brain washed oldest sibling?
Well first off, and I'm not saying this as an atheist but as a film buff, Risen is a terrible fucking movie. Acting is blah, the cinematography is garbage, and fuck me but is the pacing terrible. Terrible.

Ya don't watch that crap, not even cause it's religious but because it's just a shit film in general.

EDIT: .....He's refusing to type "Satan" isn't he? Goddamnit. /facepalm

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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