the God term
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11-05-2013, 02:53 PM
RE: the God term
There is no right or wrong, only varying degrees of better or worse. There, now you can stop arguing.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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11-05-2013, 02:58 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 02:41 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 01:55 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  No, I think you're being disingenuous here. You've twisted words before and this is simply more twisting on your part.

Love is fine, it's an acquired emotion and there's nothing wrong with it. It's not always good -- you can love the wrong person. The feelings are nice -- no one is arguing that those feelings aren't nice.

god hasn't a thing to do with love. God hasn't any thing to do with the morals a society adopts -- what is completely amoral to once group, is perfectly fine to others. Like girls getting married as young as 9. We think it's wrong, they argue it's not.

Or female circumcision -- yes that bugs me to no end and i believe it should be stopped -- but thats based on MY world view. However, in some societies it's still performed. And our country, during the 1950s doctors actually did it, for women who seemed 'hysterical' or preoccupied with sex and to treat depression.

Morality is completely subjective and so is truth. There isn't any absolutes; it comes down to what you believe. If you believe it's ok to have 4 wives and you can afford it...that's your truth and it's absolute.

I or anyone else doesn't have to accept your truth. Just because many people agree its fine to have as many wives and children as you can care for -- doesn't make it right for EVERYONE ELSE.

Is any of this making any sense to you?
Sure, you make plenty of sense. I have no problem understanding your perspective. You may percieve that I am twisting words but you actually agree with what I have said.

Here's the problem as I have already said. What is immoral in one place is then moral in another is the very problem and the source of all moral conflict. Therefore I am not saying this doesn't happen or that this is not how it is. Moreover this is a blindness or manipulation of the mind since obviously neither terms moral or immoral ever hold true to their meaning. And that is because of varying versions of the absolute that would otherwise define the true and false directions they are meant to describe. To see things this way is in fact immoral of itself. It is idolatry since you might as well be saying there is no right and wrong. True Morality however is not defined by a single persons subjective view, but ultimately by those behaviors that best serve the community as a whole.

What is moral serves Love. What is perverted is a perversion of that Love. How much you want to bet that female circumcision is a perverted form of love, created by a corrupt image of god?

All gods are corrupt because they are based off a lie. Even yours, though you try to twist and turn and pretend. That is why there is no such thing as absolute morality. Blame it on what you like but your premiss is flawed from the start, you claim an absolute and get petulant when shown it is not an absolute. Love conquers all is a fairy tale in the real world it is often destroyed by hate and fear.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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11-05-2013, 03:10 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 02:53 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  There is no right or wrong, only varying degrees of better or worse. There, now you can stop arguing.
Respectfully, varying degrees of better or worse pertaining to right and wrong.
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11-05-2013, 03:10 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 01:57 PM)Vera Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 11:43 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  

Ohmigosh! Sphynx kitties!

childsbrain, go peddle your crap some place else. We have really important things to discuss now.

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Sooo adorable!


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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11-05-2013, 03:18 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 03:10 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 02:53 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  There is no right or wrong, only varying degrees of better or worse. There, now you can stop arguing.
Respectfully, varying degrees of better or worse pertaining to right and wrong.

There is no definition that you can give the word right to make it an absolute. It is a concept, not a tangible object or force. Your imagined absolute of right, is god, as embodied by love.

Right, god, and love are words that describe concepts, they are not tangible. God only exists as a concept of your imagination.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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11-05-2013, 03:20 PM (This post was last modified: 11-05-2013 03:29 PM by childeye.)
RE: the God term
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11-05-2013, 03:26 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 03:18 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 03:10 PM)childeye Wrote:  Respectfully, varying degrees of better or worse pertaining to right and wrong.

There is no definition that you can give the word right to make it an absolute. It is a concept, not a tangible object or force. Your imagined absolute of right, is god, as embodied by love.

Right, god, and love are words that describe concepts, they are not tangible. God only exists as a concept of your imagination.
Not exactly True. I didn't imagine the Gospel. What is Spiritual is perceived spiritually and is only tangible in that regard. You your self said Love is good and Love is real, therefore Love is right. Respectfully, again you contradict yourself.
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11-05-2013, 03:42 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 03:26 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 03:18 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  There is no definition that you can give the word right to make it an absolute. It is a concept, not a tangible object or force. Your imagined absolute of right, is god, as embodied by love.

Right, god, and love are words that describe concepts, they are not tangible. God only exists as a concept of your imagination.
Not exactly True. I didn't imagine the Gospel. What is Spiritual is perceived spiritually and is only tangible in that regard. You your self said Love is good and Love is real, therefore Love is right. Respectfully, again you contradict yourself.

You didn't imagine the gospel, but somebody sure did. You just fell for it. You are imagining what is spiritual also. It's called wishful thinking with a healthy dose of confirmation bias.

Is this all you have to offer childeye? Frankly I'm disappointed, I thought you might have had a better argument. Oh well.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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11-05-2013, 03:43 PM
RE: the God term
(11-05-2013 02:41 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(11-05-2013 01:55 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  No, I think you're being disingenuous here. You've twisted words before and this is simply more twisting on your part.

Love is fine, it's an acquired emotion and there's nothing wrong with it. It's not always good -- you can love the wrong person. The feelings are nice -- no one is arguing that those feelings aren't nice.

god hasn't a thing to do with love. God hasn't any thing to do with the morals a society adopts -- what is completely amoral to once group, is perfectly fine to others. Like girls getting married as young as 9. We think it's wrong, they argue it's not.

Or female circumcision -- yes that bugs me to no end and i believe it should be stopped -- but thats based on MY world view. However, in some societies it's still performed. And our country, during the 1950s doctors actually did it, for women who seemed 'hysterical' or preoccupied with sex and to treat depression.

Morality is completely subjective and so is truth. There isn't any absolutes; it comes down to what you believe. If you believe it's ok to have 4 wives and you can afford it...that's your truth and it's absolute.

I or anyone else doesn't have to accept your truth. Just because many people agree its fine to have as many wives and children as you can care for -- doesn't make it right for EVERYONE ELSE.

Is any of this making any sense to you?
Sure, you make plenty of sense. I have no problem understanding your perspective. You may percieve that I am twisting words but you actually agree with what I have said.

Here's the problem as I have already said. What is immoral in one place is then moral in another is the very problem and the source of all moral conflict. Therefore I am not saying this doesn't happen or that this is not how it is. Moreover this is a blindness or manipulation of the mind since obviously neither terms moral or immoral ever hold true to their meaning. And that is because of varying versions of the absolute that would otherwise define the true and false directions they are meant to describe. To see things this way is in fact immoral of itself. It is idolatry since you might as well be saying there is no right and wrong. True Morality however is not defined by a single persons subjective view, but ultimately by those behaviors that best serve the community as a whole.

What is truly moral serves True Love. What is perverted is a perversion of that Love. How much you want to bet that female circumcision is a perverted form of love, created by a corrupt image of god?

I completely disagree. People who believe in female circumcision believe its very morally needed. While I might view all genital mutilation corrupt the practice remains.

Love again hasn't anything to do with it.

Your whole love is good...falls very short. Love isn't always good. You can add a capital letter to any keyword you choose it doesn't change the fact.

I really feel your the one who's been manipulated to believe that a simple lie is an absolute truth. You obviously have a need for this to be true, otherwise you wouldn't still be here.

People who practice polygamy believe their love is absolutely true and sanctioned by god.

You keep moving the goal posts...there's an absolute truth and a not absolute one.

Still I would continue to argue society determines morality. Period. No other authority is required and that is an absolute truth.

I do not agree with your application of "love is good" standard. There isn't any god, ergo god cannot equal love of any kind. It's just a cheap bastardizatuon of what people believe.

If this seems rather fragmented I apologize. My husband is yammering in my ear about wanting a blow job while he watches a dirty Harry movie. Tomorrow is mothers day, so insists he get his reward first. Tongue

Shoo fly


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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11-05-2013, 03:50 PM
RE: the God term
So this one time I talked to a brick wall, but then I got bored really quickly.

How do you guys manage to go on for this long?

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