the God term
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18-04-2013, 11:03 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 10:36 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:02 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  Alright, like the fool I am, I'll bite. I've had a couple cocktails, so what the fuck right?

One question, what the gal-dern do you mean by A christ?
I just want to prove you don't know anything about Christianity. I want to prove to all of these atheists here, that they don't know anything about Christianity. So I am not going to tell you what a Christ/Messiah is yet. I want the atheists to line up and tell me what a Christ/Messiah is. Because if they can't answer, then they must admit they don't know what Christianity is. I want you to see just how ignorant they are since you think they know so much.

Yeah, I know what a "christ is". Doesn't take a "belieber" to learn some definitions. Some of us here have studied religion a LOT more than you ever will.
You,.... just like ALL the boring others, think you're gonna come here and tell us something we don't know, or haven't heard a million times before. Ho-hum.

A "christ" is the Greek translation oif the Hebrew term for the "annointed one", or "messiah". Jebus, (Yeshua ben Josef), *if he existed*, (and maybe he did, and maybe he didn't), was thought by some Jews (in the Way Cult, or "Christians"), (a subsect of Judaism), to be that messiah. Trouble is, he didn't fulfull his JOB. Jerusalem was destroyed anyway. The temple gone in 70 AD, or so, and the entire city in the 130's. LATER, Christians cooked up their junk about a "spiritual messiah" and "salvation", AFTER their hope for the end-times did not happen. Even your Jebus said "THIS generation shall not pass away ... etc". He was all wrong too.
Not such a hot record that.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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18-04-2013, 11:03 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 10:55 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:48 PM)childeye Wrote:  You were a believer? No way. If you were a believer then you can tell me what a Christ is. I'll bet you don't even know what a Christ/Messiah is.

fuck, calm down, Mr. Hyde. Why don't you explain to us "ignorant" atheists what a christ is, and maybe we can discuss it.
I told you before. I want to show you the atheists don't know what a Messiah\Christ is. I've asked at least four here. Still no response. You can google it, but all you will learn is the term Messiah/Christ means annointed. That does not say what being anointed means. I will come back tommorrow and see if anyone here even knows what a Messiah is. Then we will discuss it.
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18-04-2013, 11:04 PM
RE: the God term
See the above. Idiot.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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18-04-2013, 11:07 PM (This post was last modified: 18-04-2013 11:11 PM by childeye.)
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 11:03 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:36 PM)childeye Wrote:  I just want to prove you don't know anything about Christianity. I want to prove to all of these atheists here, that they don't know anything about Christianity. So I am not going to tell you what a Christ/Messiah is yet. I want the atheists to line up and tell me what a Christ/Messiah is. Because if they can't answer, then they must admit they don't know what Christianity is. I want you to see just how ignorant they are since you think they know so much.

Yeah, I know what a "christ is". Doesn't take a "belieber" to learn some definitions. Some of us here have studied religion a LOT more than you ever will.
You,.... just like ALL the boring others, think you're gonna come here and tell us something we don't know, or haven't heard a million times before. Ho-hum.

A "christ" is the Greek translation oif the Hebrew term for the "annointed one", or "messiah". Jebus, (Yeshua ben Josef), *if he existed*, (and maybe he did, and maybe he didn't), was thought by some Jews (in the Way Cult, or "Christians"), (a subsect of Judaism), to be that messiah. Trouble is, he didn't fulfull his JOB. Jerusalem was destroyed anyway. The temple gone in 70 AD, or so, and the entire city in the 130's. LATER, Christians cooked up their junk about a "spiritual messiah" and "salvation", AFTER their hope for the end-times did not happen. Even your Jebus said "THIS generation shall not pass away ... etc". He was all wrong too.
Not such a hot record that.
Of course you can google the term Messiah and find it means anointed. But what does that mean? What is an anointed? What is a Christ? You don't know. Hence you don't know what Christianity is.
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18-04-2013, 11:13 PM (This post was last modified: 19-04-2013 12:08 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: the God term
Listen idiot. If you're gonna play games, then fuck off.
An "annointed one" in Hebrew culture was just that.
If you, just like all you Christians are going to lie about what it means, and cook up your own definition, feel free.
The Ancient Near East is my field. So don't try to pull any shit here. I don't need Wiki for your common definitions.
http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/emagazine/011.html

A lot of people (and things) were annointed. Originally only the priests and temple junk were annointed to "set it apart" as a "holy". Later prophets and kings were also annointed. Many cultures used it also for healing and ridding the sick of their demons, or the preparation of dead bodies for an after-life. They got it from the surrounding cultures. Babylon annointed people, as did the Egyptians.
So, Childish, it depends on the context, and culture, and time period you're talking about. Even James, (Jebus' supposed brother), used it for healing. However Saul of Tarsus said Jebus' was the "Annointed One", clearly indicating that to him, Jebus had been "exalted" to his office/station, as THE messiah. Many Christian still do it. The Catholics actually have a "Chrism Mass" on Maundy Thursday morning for the blessing of new oils for annointings at baptisms and ordinations, episcopal consecrations, and their Sacrament of the Sick for the next year. So what were you going to say was YOURn definition of "annointing" ? I think the Anglicans do something similar. It has many meanings/uses now.
http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...other-look

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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18-04-2013, 11:14 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 11:03 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:55 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  fuck, calm down, Mr. Hyde. Why don't you explain to us "ignorant" atheists what a christ is, and maybe we can discuss it.
I told you before. I want to show you the atheists don't know what a Messiah\Christ is. I've asked at least four here. Still no response. You can google it, but all you will learn is the term Messiah/Christ means annointed. That does not say what being anointed means. I will come back tommorrow and see if anyone here even knows what a Messiah is. Then we will discuss it.

Wait, before you told me to google about exodus, then had that thrown in your face. Then you feigned ignorance and pleaded mercy for your ignorance. Now you have this weird, ambiguous google scavenger hunt for what a christ is? You fucking poe. I'll cite the most consistent word of wisdom that has appeared on this thread from the beginning.

Shoo fly.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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18-04-2013, 11:24 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 10:48 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:35 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Even when I did believe (and I was a huge believer) I never understood the fascination with Saul of Tarsus. The man was clearly anti-women, he was crazy and didn't even believe married people should have sex. Until he probably realized that no sex meant no babies...which of course wouldn't do. Shows how far seizures and hallucinating can get you!
You were a believer? No way. If you were a believer then you can tell me what a Christ is. I'll bet you don't even know what a Christ/Messiah is.

I attended a baptist school k-6 then was sent to a catholic jr high school. I went to church every week, belonged to clubs and ya I believed it all. I read the bible and tried to help classmates see the light. Then I began reading about mythology and the layers of the onion began peeling. The more I read about evolution through natural selection, the more I found I couldn't believe. My very best friend is a Jewish Rabbi (I met him 30 years ago). He's a super sweet guy and he's taught me more about Judiesm than ive ever known.

So yea I was fully indoctrinated and a card carrying Christian soldier for jebus. I sang the songs and said with total reverence the prayers..

I would say a good 80% of those of us here are completely aware of who Christ was. Most of us were believers. Some of us were obnoxious like you full of righteous indignation.

We weren't raised by chimps yanno.

*S M A C K*
(the sound of a gnat being squished).

Now shoo fly


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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18-04-2013, 11:24 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 10:45 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 10:28 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Naw it's ok man, cause remember the debate is never for the guy you're talking to, its for all the people listening. You almost never going to actually get someone to change their position in a debate. Thats not the point of the debate. Troll boy here did you and me a favor (grammar nazi's go fuck yourself I don't care) we got to practice our debating a bit. We made some good points and a few points that needed to be better stated. Also of note if there is a new person waiting in the wings, not sure what they believe they got to see the difference between a rational skeptical approach and a very good imitation of a fundie. With any luck maybe this got at least one person thinking and maybe even investigating their beliefs.

Tis better to debate a troll than to let stupidity go unchallenged.
Okay revenant 77. You think you know all about Christianity. Do you even know what a Christ\Messiah is?

I don't claim to be an expert on all of a religion that has been around for over 1700 years. I am particularly ignorant of Catholic Practices pre-1500's but one of these days I will try to cure that ignorance.

Now to answer your question what is a Christ? In the coptic greek Christos translates to Anointed and was first used in relation to the religion that would eventually coalesce into christianity by a Saul/Paul of Tarsus. The religion Paul was promoting was much closer to the Coptic greek mystery cults of the time with a splash of Judaism. Paul's Christo's was what would later become the basis for the Holy Spirit. Paul is an interesting figure and the basis for much of the bible, over 20% of the new testament is based on his supposed writings. What we know of the Paul is little more than we know of the historical Jesus (Yeshua ben Joseph is a likely candidate) Paul may or may not have been a Pharosis, a Roman agent or possibly even the pen name of a famous historian Josephus writing pro-roman propaganda under his name. There is a fantastic thread on the historical Paul on this forum.

Part 2 what is a Messiah? The Hebrew word מָשִׁיחַ translated into greek and then much much later into english means much the same as the word Christos Anointed. This word was used in the hebrew bible for many things and people. The Greek Septuagint version of the Old Testament renders all thirty-nine instances of the Hebrew word for "anointed" (Mašíaḥ) as Χριστός (Khristós). The New Testament records the Greek transliteration Μεσσίας, Messias twice in John. It can also be used to identify rulers such as Cyrus, king of Persia a non-jew. So it does not necessarily have a religious meaning.

In the context of the 1st and 2nd century bce the term began to take on a military tone meaning one who would rise up to overthrow Rome and fulfill the prophesies of a worldwide Jewish lead state. There were I believe 100 of these prophesies (Bucky and Mark if you can correct me on this I would appreciate as it is too late to be doing heavy research) and so far the consensus among the Jews is that none of them have been fulfilled. Simon Bar Kokba got perhaps the furthest of all the Messianic figures wandering around palestine in the 1st century ce but even he was laid low by the Pagan armies of Rome.

Well thats the dime store version. For more information please visit your local library.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-04-2013, 11:38 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 11:13 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Listen idiot. If you're gonna play games, then fuck off.
An "annointed one" in Hebrew culture was just that.
If you, just like all you Christians are going to lie about what it means, and cook up your own definition, feel free.
The Ancient Near East is my field. So don't try to pull any shit here. I don't need Wiki for your common definitions.
http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/emagazine/011.html

Well damn Bucky. If I knew you were gonna bother with this troll I wouldn't have written out that post twice, freaking hit a button and lost the entire thing the first time. Oh well good practice for the next time a jeebus freak shows up. Anyway I cannot seem to remember how many prophecies the supposed messiah was to fulfill. I guessed at 100 in that post but I don't think thats right.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-04-2013, 11:46 PM
RE: the God term
(18-04-2013 11:14 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  
(18-04-2013 11:03 PM)childeye Wrote:  I told you before. I want to show you the atheists don't know what a Messiah\Christ is. I've asked at least four here. Still no response. You can google it, but all you will learn is the term Messiah/Christ means annointed. That does not say what being anointed means. I will come back tommorrow and see if anyone here even knows what a Messiah is. Then we will discuss it.

Wait, before you told me to google about exodus, then had that thrown in your face. Then you feigned ignorance and pleaded mercy for your ignorance. Now you have this weird, ambiguous google scavenger hunt for what a christ is? You fucking poe. I'll cite the most consistent word of wisdom that has appeared on this thread from the beginning.

Shoo fly.

Lmao! He's on the ropes and only cares about his version of the truth. He doesn't know shit about the exodus, he doesn't know shit about messiah or even what the messiah was supposed to do. If he did he'd understsnd there's no way it was "the christ"

See he wants to be superior. He needs it. That's why he keeps backpedaling. It's ok for him to send us to google, but if he thinks we're using google to answer his questions we're disqualified. Yep DLJ called him a Poe, KC abandoned this thread long ago too seeing he just wasn't worth the effort...sigh....

When will I learn to just walk away?

Weeping


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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