the sacrificial lamb
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23-12-2013, 08:04 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 08:01 PM)freetoreason Wrote:  
(23-12-2013 07:22 PM)Alla Wrote:  One God = one Union of three separate Gods.
So you're a polytheist, not a trinitarian. I'm cool with that.
OKSmile

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23-12-2013, 08:08 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  Is it written in the Bible? or is it your opinion?

It is certainly not written in the bible that it was God's plan. Good luck attempting to dig yourself out of that hole, without resorting to nefarious reaching tactics.

(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  Everything what happened in the Garden of Eden was plan of God.

Repeating the falsity does not make it true. If your god knows all, the outcome of everything, then it would be rather silly of him to go ahead with the plan and then act completely mad that the outcome did not pan out as he had hoped.

Theists need to actually read the bible instead of reaching for answers that do not logically fit the written word.


(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  It was not a punishment. It was a consequence.

Clearly, you need an introduction to a dictionary. Adam was punished, plain and simple.
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23-12-2013, 08:51 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 07:39 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(23-12-2013 07:29 PM)Chas Wrote:  John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

That is what I am referring to.
Where does it say that taking away sin of the world = taking away personal responsibility?
What sin was John talking about? A: Adam's sin

Jesus took sin of Adam because nobody is responsible for Adam's sin. And Adam is not responsible for that sin. It was God's plan that Adam would fall. Adam chose to obey another God's law - to be with his wife and multiply and replenish.
And Adam didn't know that break the law = bad/wrong/evil/sin.
God doesn't punish for being ignorant.

And that 'explanation' is totally incoherent.

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23-12-2013, 08:53 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 08:08 PM)Foxen Wrote:  
(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  Is it written in the Bible? or is it your opinion?

It is certainly not written in the bible that it was God's plan. Good luck attempting to dig yourself out of that hole, without resorting to nefarious reaching tactics.

(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  Everything what happened in the Garden of Eden was plan of God.

Repeating the falsity does not make it true. If your god knows all, the outcome of everything, then it would be rather silly of him to go ahead with the plan and then act completely mad that the outcome did not pan out as he had hoped.

Theists need to actually read the bible instead of reaching for answers that do not logically fit the written word.


(23-12-2013 07:59 PM)Alla Wrote:  It was not a punishment. It was a consequence.

Clearly, you need an introduction to a dictionary. Adam was punished, plain and simple.
I don't mind you have your opinion about what Bible says.

English is not my native language.
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23-12-2013, 08:54 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 07:39 PM)Alla Wrote:  God doesn't punish for being ignorant.

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23-12-2013, 08:55 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 08:53 PM)Alla Wrote:  I don't mind you have your opinion about what Bible says.

Cute evasion tactic. Do not think you are off the hook because of it. Wink
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23-12-2013, 08:57 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 08:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(23-12-2013 07:39 PM)Alla Wrote:  Where does it say that taking away sin of the world = taking away personal responsibility?
What sin was John talking about? A: Adam's sin

Jesus took sin of Adam because nobody is responsible for Adam's sin. And Adam is not responsible for that sin. It was God's plan that Adam would fall. Adam chose to obey another God's law - to be with his wife and multiply and replenish.
And Adam didn't know that break the law = bad/wrong/evil/sin.
God doesn't punish for being ignorant.

And that 'explanation' is totally incoherent.
Big Grin
Where does it say that to take sin of this world = taking away personal responsibility? and what is sin of this world?

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23-12-2013, 09:00 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 08:55 PM)Foxen Wrote:  
(23-12-2013 08:53 PM)Alla Wrote:  I don't mind you have your opinion about what Bible says.

Cute evasion tactic. Do not think you are off the hook because of it. Wink
What you say is not in the Bible. I just can not prove that your opinion(understanding) is wrong.

English is not my native language.
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23-12-2013, 09:07 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
(23-12-2013 09:00 PM)Alla Wrote:  What you say is not in the Bible.

More accurately, it is all in there because what one reads is open to interpretation.

The difference arises in whether or not to accept one interpretation over another.

Too bad the writers are not here to explain to us precisely what they meant when they wrote what they did.

What can be certain, however, is that there is no clear evidence for the existence of god.

All a theist has for supposed proof is personal, subjective, experience and the bible, both of which is not real proof for god's existence.
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23-12-2013, 09:35 PM
RE: the sacrificial lamb
The premise of Jesus being the sacrificial lamb comes from the crucifixion account in the gospel of John, the author of said book who moved the date of the crucifixion to the day of Passover so that Jesus could be the lamb slaughtered for Passover, rather than the Passover meal that Jesus and the disciples prepared and enjoyed in the Last Supper the evening before, as in the other three gospel accounts.

"To many readers it will now seem obvious: John or someone who told him the story, made a slight change in a historical datum (changing the date of the crucifixion: the day of the preparation for Passover, not the day after, 19:14) in order to score a theological point. For John, Jesus really was the Lamb of God. He died at the same time (on the afternoon on the day of Preparation), in the same place (Jerusalem), and at the hands of the same people (the Jewish leaders, especially the priests) as the Passover lambs."
- Ehrman, Jesus: Apocalyptic Prophet of the New Millennium

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