we were founded on Christianity!
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17-03-2016, 12:18 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
I just think its funny how people try so hard to convenience themselves that what they believe is true. And then to try to say that the facts I provided is my opinion. Lol
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17-03-2016, 01:25 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 12:18 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  I just think its funny how people try so hard to convenience themselves that what they believe is true. And then to try to say that the facts I provided is my opinion. Lol

Actually the founders were heavily influenced by John Locke, the Anglo Saxons and Marcus Cicero. This country was also heavily influenced by Aristotelianism. Now many of the founders were Christians as well as some deists but their political ideas were almost pure Objectivism, even though it didn't exist at the time. Their problem was that they had the right political ideas but they did not have a proper metaphysics and ethics to go with them. They were very much steeped in the ethics of religion, so there were major contradictions in their ideas.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

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The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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17-03-2016, 01:51 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 01:25 PM)true scotsman Wrote:  
(17-03-2016 12:18 PM)purpledaisies Wrote:  I just think its funny how people try so hard to convenience themselves that what they believe is true. And then to try to say that the facts I provided is my opinion. Lol

Actually the founders were heavily influenced by John Locke, the Anglo Saxons and Marcus Cicero. This country was also heavily influenced by Aristotelianism. Now many of the founders were Christians as well as some deists but their political ideas were almost pure Objectivism, even though it didn't exist at the time. Their problem was that they had the right political ideas but they did not have a proper metaphysics and ethics to go with them. They were very much steeped in the ethics of religion, so there were major contradictions in their ideas.

Not that there is a real "they"; they weren't all anything...

Why do people try to reduce a group of people who strongly disagreed with each other all the time into a hivemind that conveniently agrees with them?

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17-03-2016, 01:51 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
The American government might not have been specifically founded on Christianity but it was the product of a culture that was shaped by Christianity. The prohibition of an establishment of religion is often interpreted to mean that any expression of religion by the government is prohibited. Actually it means that the government can't make a specific denomination the established church. Many of the colonies did have such official churches; for example the Anglican church was the official church of Virginian and I believe the Congregational church was the official church of Massachusetts. The constitution does not prohibit the government favoring Christianity as a whole, although court decisions have in effect imposed such a prohibition.

The information in ancient libraries came from real minds of real people. The far more complex information in cells came from the far more intelligent mind of God.
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17-03-2016, 01:54 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 01:31 AM)purpledaisies Wrote:  For the past 2 days I've been debating a good friend of mines sister about being founded on Christianity.

She says we were I corrected her and said no we weren't and provided a link to the treaty of tripoli. She has been arguing with me for 2 days now and I keeping asking for proof of her claims but nothing just word salad. Finally she said there isn't any then said she would get me my proof then said she won't waste her time so she won't and she has better things to do.

Then again said she would find proof then again went back on it. Then said that she believes what she believes and I believe what I believe. And I won.

I told her that its not about winning but about facts and the fact is that we were not founded on religion and I provided proof as that. And the fact is that u have provided proof as of yet. And let me ask u if we were founded on religion would we have a treaty that says otherwise?

She came back with I'll provide you proof. Then no again and back and forth til she said, well I'll believe we were founded on Christianity .

I told her well you believe what you want and do what ever you that's the beauty of our country. You can believe what you want you just cant force others to obey your beliefs in the form of laws. And I will continue to correct misinformation when I see it so its not seen as truth.

She also tried to pull the bakers baking cakes on me and I shut that down too with antidiscrimation laws and why they were in the wrong. Then she tried to pull that Christians are losing their rights. I asked her to provide examples and nothing. Lol

I think I did very well.
Depends entirely who the "we" is that foundered.
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17-03-2016, 01:55 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 01:51 PM)theophilus Wrote:  The American government might not have been specifically founded on Christianity but it was the product of a culture that was shaped by Christianity. The prohibition of an establishment of religion is often interpreted to mean that any expression of religion by the government is prohibited. Actually it means that the government can't make a specific denomination the established church. Many of the colonies did have such official churches; for example the Anglican church was the official church of Virginian and I believe the Congregational church was the official church of Massachusetts. The constitution does not prohibit the government favoring Christianity as a whole, although court decisions have in effect imposed such a prohibition.

You must have stopped counting before you got to the 14th amentment, then.

Keep reading! But don't freak out too hard when you get to the 18th; I promise it gets better.

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17-03-2016, 02:00 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 04:59 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  You'll find that "Christianity" is far more liquid than most Christians are willing to admit.

Ask a Baptist if a Catholic is a "real" xtian - and you're likely to get some hemming and hawing. Same goes, vice versa.

Then have some real fun and ask about the Mormons, the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Branch Dividians -

then the real sidestepping, verbal gymnastics and other fun forms of spin doctoring will ensue..........
Are you aware of why Mormons are considered to not be Christians? Once upon a time there was a society of all Christian churches formed. They kept statistics like baseball stats. Each year they published who won in each category. One was new conversions, one was the number of missionaries, another was how much the member churches were collecting in their begging operations among their members. There were more than that. But the Mormons won in almost every category every year for the first 4 years, so like some reality show they were voted off the island! If ya can't beat 'em run them off!
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17-03-2016, 02:02 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 12:11 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(17-03-2016 12:05 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  You could remind her that the Pilgrims came here PRECISELY to escape religious tyranny in Europe, and be free to practice what they saw fit, and ESCAPE the Christians in England and Europe. "America founded on Christianity" is religious tyranny.

Let's be fair. The Puritans in New England wanted their own religious tyranny.

They didn't institute a death penalty for visiting Quaker preachers up from Pennsylvania for nothing.

EDIT:
Of course, to add, each of the original colonies had rather different stances on religion and freedom thereof. New Amsterdam didn't give a shit. The Carolinas and especially Virginia were pretty establishment (ie of the English aristocracy). Maryland started out Catholic. Pennsylvania was heavily Quaker but in practice by far the most tolerant. Etc...

Agree. But they were nothing like Southern Baptists, (who are the people you often hear this nonsense from).

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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17-03-2016, 09:46 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 12:05 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  You could remind her that the Pilgrims came here PRECISELY to escape religious tyranny in Europe, and be free to practice what they saw fit, and ESCAPE the Christians in England and Europe. "America founded on Christianity" is religious tyranny.

Free to practice their version and discriminate against everyone else.

They did not practice tolerance of any kind.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-03-2016, 09:49 PM
RE: we were founded on Christianity!
(17-03-2016 01:51 PM)theophilus Wrote:  The American government might not have been specifically founded on Christianity but it was the product of a culture that was shaped by Christianity. The prohibition of an establishment of religion is often interpreted to mean that any expression of religion by the government is prohibited. Actually it means that the government can't make a specific denomination the established church. Many of the colonies did have such official churches; for example the Anglican church was the official church of Virginian and I believe the Congregational church was the official church of Massachusetts. The constitution does not prohibit the government favoring Christianity as a whole, although court decisions have in effect imposed such a prohibition.

The Constitution prohibits the establishment of any religion; it is not talking about just Christianity.

And the authors of the Constitution were gentlemen of The Enlightenment as much if not more than they were Christian.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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