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14-03-2015, 01:29 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 01:12 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 10:09 AM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  I'm sorry, but why should you feed someone who is a visible drain on resources and does nothing to help themselves.

It's... the issue is that they made it *illegal* to feed the homeless. By all means establish your work for food program or whatever the fuck else, but just because *you* can't see a reason why doesn't mean you get the right to obstruct other people from performing a generous action.

Besides, *you yourself* are a visible drain on resources and not obviously useful. I sentence you to the work camps. See how that works out for you Dodgy

How do you justify sentencing someone who works for a living to a camp that puts people to work for the good of the community, in place of someone who does no work and lives on the streets? It's a mutually beneficial scenario. Community benefits. Person benefits (even if they aren't willing participants). Yes

However I did miss the part about it being illegal. I think that such a camp ought to be set up before debating the legality of anything. Undecided

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14-03-2015, 01:35 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 01:29 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  How do you justify sentencing someone who works for a living to a camp that puts people to work for the good of the community, in place of someone who does no work and lives on the streets? It's a mutually beneficial scenario. Community benefits. Person benefits (even if they aren't willing participants). Yes

Well ya see, it's the definition thing. You think throwing tin cans over your shoulder, or making movies, or growing weed, or whatever you do constitutes working for a living, the US govt dept of forced labour thinks not... next thing you know, you're out building roads.

Besides the 'aren't willing participants' gets my goat a bit. Why should *you* get to choose your direction and you feel happy to choose someone else's *for* them. Fuck that shit. What will you do to me if I spit in your eye and tell you to go fuck yourself with your work for food program? Put me in a chain gang? At what point do you decide that you're going to far?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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14-03-2015, 06:54 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 01:35 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 01:29 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  How do you justify sentencing someone who works for a living to a camp that puts people to work for the good of the community, in place of someone who does no work and lives on the streets? It's a mutually beneficial scenario. Community benefits. Person benefits (even if they aren't willing participants). Yes

Well ya see, it's the definition thing. You think throwing tin cans over your shoulder, or making movies, or growing weed, or whatever you do constitutes working for a living, the US govt dept of forced labour thinks not... next thing you know, you're out building roads.

Besides the 'aren't willing participants' gets my goat a bit. Why should *you* get to choose your direction and you feel happy to choose someone else's *for* them. Fuck that shit. What will you do to me if I spit in your eye and tell you to go fuck yourself with your work for food program? Put me in a chain gang? At what point do you decide that you're going to far?

I suppose it's the difference in mindset. I want to see a world where we all earn our keep, and where every individual has a strong work ethic, or a desire to better themselves all the time. And let's be frank, no matter what government you're under, you are having your direction monitored, if not controlled by the powers that be to some extent. I'm not talking concentration camps here either. I'm talking a system alike community service. You can spit in my eye and tell me to go fuck myself, but if you're not contributing to the society you live in, you ought to very well be made to work for free; or have the choice of leaving the country.

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14-03-2015, 07:03 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 01:29 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 01:12 PM)morondog Wrote:  It's... the issue is that they made it *illegal* to feed the homeless. By all means establish your work for food program or whatever the fuck else, but just because *you* can't see a reason why doesn't mean you get the right to obstruct other people from performing a generous action.

Besides, *you yourself* are a visible drain on resources and not obviously useful. I sentence you to the work camps. See how that works out for you Dodgy

How do you justify sentencing someone who works for a living to a camp that puts people to work for the good of the community, in place of someone who does no work and lives on the streets? It's a mutually beneficial scenario. Community benefits. Person benefits (even if they aren't willing participants). Yes

However I did miss the part about it being illegal. I think that such a camp ought to be set up before debating the legality of anything. Undecided

You seem to be assuming that every unemployed person wants to be that way.
How would you feel about this if you, yourself, through no fault of your own, found yourself "living on the streets"?
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14-03-2015, 07:26 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 07:03 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 01:29 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  How do you justify sentencing someone who works for a living to a camp that puts people to work for the good of the community, in place of someone who does no work and lives on the streets? It's a mutually beneficial scenario. Community benefits. Person benefits (even if they aren't willing participants). Yes

However I did miss the part about it being illegal. I think that such a camp ought to be set up before debating the legality of anything. Undecided

You seem to be assuming that every unemployed person wants to be that way.
How would you feel about this if you, yourself, through no fault of your own, found yourself "living on the streets"?

I do not assume this. Community Service for the Involuntarily Homeless would be just the same. I would be glad that if such a system existed, in which I could do services for the local community in return for food and shelter, while I continue to embark upon my search for a paying full time job that fits my qualifications (whether they be great or null).

Think about it this way. You wouldn't have need for 'volunteer soup kitchens' or 'homeless shelters' because there would be paid people to run these. You would have those who are (by choice or not) working in their local community to keep it clean and tidy and do general repairs until they can acquire paying work.

Of course, this is all completely hypothetical. There is no way to know if this would work in practice or not, unless you know of an example of such a system in modern society (last 50 years or so) that has taken place in the same or a similar way.

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14-03-2015, 07:44 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 07:26 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 07:03 PM)pablo Wrote:  You seem to be assuming that every unemployed person wants to be that way.
How would you feel about this if you, yourself, through no fault of your own, found yourself "living on the streets"?

I do not assume this. Community Service for the Involuntarily Homeless would be just the same. I would be glad that if such a system existed, in which I could do services for the local community in return for food and shelter, while I continue to embark upon my search for a paying full time job that fits my qualifications (whether they be great or null).

Think about it this way. You wouldn't have need for 'volunteer soup kitchens' or 'homeless shelters' because there would be paid people to run these. You would have those who are (by choice or not) working in their local community to keep it clean and tidy and do general repairs until they can acquire paying work.

Of course, this is all completely hypothetical. There is no way to know if this would work in practice or not, unless you know of an example of such a system in modern society (last 50 years or so) that has taken place in the same or a similar way.

Communism really hasn't worked out too well for those who have tried it.
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14-03-2015, 07:52 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 07:44 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 07:26 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  I do not assume this. Community Service for the Involuntarily Homeless would be just the same. I would be glad that if such a system existed, in which I could do services for the local community in return for food and shelter, while I continue to embark upon my search for a paying full time job that fits my qualifications (whether they be great or null).

Think about it this way. You wouldn't have need for 'volunteer soup kitchens' or 'homeless shelters' because there would be paid people to run these. You would have those who are (by choice or not) working in their local community to keep it clean and tidy and do general repairs until they can acquire paying work.

Of course, this is all completely hypothetical. There is no way to know if this would work in practice or not, unless you know of an example of such a system in modern society (last 50 years or so) that has taken place in the same or a similar way.

Communism really hasn't worked out too well for those who have tried it.

Some might say Communism has never been tried truly. But is what I suggest Communism? That everyone contributes to society, in return for state care and recompense? That is of course, if they do not already have a paying job/career.

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14-03-2015, 07:59 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 07:52 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 07:44 PM)pablo Wrote:  Communism really hasn't worked out too well for those who have tried it.

Some might say Communism has never been tried truly. But is what I suggest Communism? That everyone contributes to society, in return for state care and recompense? That is of course, if they do not already have a paying job/career.

So some people would have government jobs and some wouldn't?
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14-03-2015, 08:08 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
(14-03-2015 07:59 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(14-03-2015 07:52 PM)Αθεία Αμβρόσιος Wrote:  Some might say Communism has never been tried truly. But is what I suggest Communism? That everyone contributes to society, in return for state care and recompense? That is of course, if they do not already have a paying job/career.

So some people would have government jobs and some wouldn't?

Incidentally, yes. (Like most governments today). Paid politicians, public servants, etc.

It's not ideal at that end of the scale, corruption is always present in the seat of power. But then I am focusing on the bottom of the scale, where the disadvantaged and homeless are put to work in return for food and shelter. A system that requires you to pay in, for them to pay out. Surely it's contributing to an unsustainable financial climate that is created from all the spending of money on people who do not work and benefit the country/society in question?

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14-03-2015, 08:14 PM
RE: wow Florida wow
Are you thinking of a large-scale communistic program working inside of a capitalistic economy?
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