wtf are noetics?
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14-07-2014, 11:59 AM
RE: wtf are noetics?
(14-07-2014 11:51 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(14-07-2014 08:28 AM)cjlr Wrote:  Observation necessitates interaction. There's no meaningful phenomenological difference; "passive" is not a coherent term at a quantum level.

But yeah, observation as a term is deprecated precisely due to that history of misunderstanding. Interaction is clearer (with measurement being a subset of controlled interaction).

If I am observing a planet, I am seeing it by reflected light. That is observing, not measuring. My observation has no effect on the planet.

In doing so you are interacting with the photons, and you are absolutely affecting them.

But really that's just an issue of terminology. I'm a quantum type person, so when I say "observe" or "interact" I mean it at an immediate level. A cosmologist who says the "observe" something is referring to a several-times-abstracted process of information gathering.

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14-07-2014, 12:08 PM (This post was last modified: 14-07-2014 12:15 PM by Chas.)
RE: wtf are noetics?
(14-07-2014 11:59 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(14-07-2014 11:51 AM)Chas Wrote:  If I am observing a planet, I am seeing it by reflected light. That is observing, not measuring. My observation has no effect on the planet.

In doing so you are interacting with the photons, and you are absolutely affecting them.

I'm not affecting the planet.

Quote:But really that's just an issue of terminology. I'm a quantum type person, so when I say "observe" or "interact" I mean it at an immediate level. A cosmologist who says the "observe" something is referring to a several-times-abstracted process of information gathering.

That is precisely the confusion I am trying to point out and dispel. People generally misunderstand what a quantum physicist means by 'observation' and all kinds of mischief ensue.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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