yintheist yangtheist
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07-05-2014, 04:27 AM
Tongue yintheist yangtheist
Hello, everybody. First off, everything I read, both theist and atheist, claim that I cannot be both. However, I am a horrible atheist and a worse theist. I don’t believe in overt proselytizing whether it is door to door or through legislation but I have some skill proselytizing for either side when asked. So, what am I? (I will forgo the puns for now) I will let you decide if I am an atheist posing as a theist or a theist who just won’t fully let go and be an atheist but I can argue either way so let me know if you want me to argue the theology or the philosophy of an issue. Really I am Taoist which is non-theistic but does not prohibit theism and it explores duality so you can see how it might be a safe place for me to reside, lol. I am also a bit silly, my favorite atheist are Isaac Asimov, Duglas Adams, Carl Sagan and Lenard Sussken while my favorite theist are CS Lewis, Albert Einstein, Gregor Mendel, and RC Sproll. I hope this is ok with those on this board.
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07-05-2014, 04:45 AM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
Welcome.

Yup anything goes here.

You'll no doubt get some resistance for calling Einstein a theist and probably some flak for misspelling the forename of my favourite author... but hey... fill ya boots.

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07-05-2014, 05:45 AM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2014 05:55 AM by John.)
RE: yintheist yangtheist
(07-05-2014 04:27 AM)tsouth5 Wrote:  ... everything I read, both theist and atheist, claim that I cannot be both.

You sure can, by means of:

1) Strong cognitive dissonance. And/or
2) Gross misunderstanding of the definitions of these words.*

*As used by most self-identified atheists and recognized and supported by standard dictionaries.

Having read your other post, and noting the very last lines of it:

(07-05-2014 03:44 AM)tsouth5 Wrote:  They were never really atheist to begin with. We could even argue that they may not have been non-theist during that time either.

...it seems like the problem falls (atleast) in category 2), since usually you'll find that atheist == non-theist, especially among self-identified atheists. So it seems like your understanding of the term atheist is something that most people here would find alien. Time for clarifications I guess.

Τί ἐστιν ἀλήθεια?
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07-05-2014, 10:59 AM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
Welcome.

Albert Einstein was not a theist. Get over it.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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07-05-2014, 12:30 PM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
Welcome. Here is your welcome seal

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Also on theism and atheism.

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07-05-2014, 01:31 PM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
(07-05-2014 04:27 AM)tsouth5 Wrote:  Hello, everybody. First off, everything I read, both theist and atheist, claim that I cannot be both. However, I am a horrible atheist and a worse theist. I don’t believe in overt proselytizing whether it is door to door or through legislation but I have some skill proselytizing for either side when asked. So, what am I? (I will forgo the puns for now) I will let you decide if I am an atheist posing as a theist or a theist who just won’t fully let go and be an atheist but I can argue either way so let me know if you want me to argue the theology or the philosophy of an issue. Really I am Taoist which is non-theistic but does not prohibit theism and it explores duality so you can see how it might be a safe place for me to reside, lol. I am also a bit silly, my favorite atheist are Isaac Asimov, Duglas Adams, Carl Sagan and Lenard Sussken while my favorite theist are CS Lewis, Albert Einstein, Gregor Mendel, and RC Sproll. I hope this is ok with those on this board.

Welcome to the board. Smile

It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled. ~Mark Twain
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07-05-2014, 04:18 PM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
It always comes back to definition. In any dialog, to assume definitions because most of those a person associates agrees can lead to a lack of communication. I call Einstein a theist because he never denounced it and when details declared that he could not believe that "God played dice with the universe" he was not speaking of god the way Susskind does but rather he personified the laws of nature to have more orderly power over the universe. The inconsistency of this was pointed out to him by his colleagues but he continued to atemt to defend his position in a way remonecent to theist. Most likely, I also do this personification as well but most of the gods of history where formed through personification. I define creator and creation different from Catholics as I have been finding out while I am currently reading George Smith's "Atheism: a case against God"? I am just starting part two on Faith and I alrea suspect I am using a diferent definition of Faith as well. In any respect, when I finish the book, I hope have a good handle on how most athirst define the concepts involved. I do have many friends who are not theist who do not use the word atheist. Some because they do not agree with the entomology actually matches; other's because history makes a difference to them; and the ones that leave theism because of trauma for atheism are atheist the same way an alcoholic is a non-drinker and will likely return to theism later. There are many ways to define conception of our experiences and this what I enjoy exploring most.
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07-05-2014, 04:41 PM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2014 04:46 PM by kim.)
RE: yintheist yangtheist
(07-05-2014 04:18 PM)tsouth5 Wrote:  I call Einstein a theist because he never denounced it and when details declared that he could not believe that "God played dice with the universe" he was not speaking of god the way Susskind does but rather he personified the laws of nature to have more orderly power over the universe.

It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it. ~ Albert Einstein
Albert Einstein the Human Side. (Dukas, Helen (1981). Princeton: Princeton University Press, p. 43. Einstein Archives )

There are many different people here who might "categorize" themselves in a more personal manner than simply as atheist. Glad you have come here to explore, Tsouth5.

Welcome to the forum. Smile

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.
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07-05-2014, 05:11 PM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
Thank you for the quote. I guess I should have made clear my use of the word personification. I only ment giving intelegent personality to something, though complex, is not necessarily alive. I do it with my car. I don't have a personal car as everyone can obviously see the cars existence, I just like to treat it as if it where an animal I take care of. I think I mentioned I was a bit silly, and now I have made that clear Tongue
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07-05-2014, 07:30 PM
RE: yintheist yangtheist
(07-05-2014 05:11 PM)tsouth5 Wrote:  Thank you for the quote. I guess I should have made clear my use of the word personification. I only ment giving intelegent personality to something, though complex, is not necessarily alive. I do it with my car. I don't have a personal car as everyone can obviously see the cars existence, I just like to treat it as if it where an animal I take care of. I think I mentioned I was a bit silly, and now I have made that clear Tongue

Maybe you don't understand the definition of 'theist'? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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